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	<title>Comments for Road Painter</title>
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	<link>http://roadpainter.com</link>
	<description>Making good bicycling experiences ever since 1992.</description>
	<lastBuildDate>Mon, 03 Sep 2012 05:32:07 +0000</lastBuildDate>
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		<title>Comment on Good bicycle route marking by Marty</title>
		<link>http://roadpainter.com/good-bicycle-route-marking/comment-page-1/#comment-14620</link>
		<dc:creator>Marty</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 03 Sep 2012 05:32:07 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://roadpainter.com/?p=1#comment-14620</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[If it&#039;s not temporary paint or chalk then it&#039;s graffiti. Unless of course it&#039;s approved by whomever the route is under the jurisdiction of legally. Even if using temporary paint, you need to have permission.  You can&#039;t just go painting arrows all over the place.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>If it&#8217;s not temporary paint or chalk then it&#8217;s graffiti. Unless of course it&#8217;s approved by whomever the route is under the jurisdiction of legally. Even if using temporary paint, you need to have permission.  You can&#8217;t just go painting arrows all over the place.</p>
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		<title>Comment on Good bicycle route marking by Dwaine Wheeler</title>
		<link>http://roadpainter.com/good-bicycle-route-marking/comment-page-1/#comment-12914</link>
		<dc:creator>Dwaine Wheeler</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 01 May 2012 17:42:31 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://roadpainter.com/?p=1#comment-12914</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[For the past couple decades I&#039;ve been the routemiester for GOBA and I&#039;ve also marked a LAB Rally and been the director of 20+ patch rides for the Dayton Cycling Club.

These (LAB I think) route marking protocols have working very well in moving about 3,000 cyclists a year, an average of 350 mile for the week for the past 20 years with great success on GOBA. These protocols also keep the local city and county governments happy.

Overzealous route marking in our region has created two areas that we now have to ride around, due to unhappy city government. They want their region painted in chalk only, with approval. Not going to happen. I tried and it rained…

We use Fox Valley Systems &quot;Power Paint Cartridge&quot; and the &quot;Spray Chalk&quot; which fits their &quot;Easy Marker Pistol&quot; making the job fairly easy from the driver’s seat of most cars and vans, half the time I do not exit the vechile, just pull to the right and drop an arrow.

I find this paint last longer per can and has a nice consistent spray pattern to work with. If you order it a month or two before the event, it will be fresh and if shaken properly will most never clog. It will store well over a year or two but must be shaken very well!

I find the paint lasts 2 weeks - 2 years on the road, according to traffic volume. I will not paint the city streets until a day or two before the ride so the markings are bright and fresh. On rural roads I paint 2-3 weeks in advance, re-checking them the day before the event, refreshing the worn arrows where needed, just in case.

The chalk will last through a rainstorm if put down on dry pavement and allowed to dry for a day. The chalk will last a couple/few weeks with no rain on rural roads. On city roads it will last less than a week, sometimes less than a day…

We use the chalk for rest stops, attractions and bike trails where marking is normally not permitted and put it down the night before the event. If rain is forecast, we use signs or paint.

We also use a variety of warning signs for drivers and riders, at hills, bad intersections, gravel (we sweep most gravel in corners), Rail Road tracks with arrows directing best path in red, dogs and attractions.

For maps on the road, I convert the paper and electronic maps I receive into Microsoft Streets &amp; Trips. I take my laptop, plug in a USB GPS receiver, fire up Streets &amp; Trips, tell the program to follow my direction of travel, drive to the start of the ride and follow the route on the computer. Doing this alone cut 10 hours off of painting the GOBA route with less mistakes to fix. And will make a century route with cut-offs, a one day painting job.

Always take a case of black paint to cover up mistakes and old route markings that may confuse your riders.

If the intersection confuses you the painter, take extra time and on the wrong roads about 200 yards up from the intersection, in red paint, tell the riders to turn back, &quot;NO&quot; wrong road. This one thing will really pay off.

PROTOCOLS

   Mark every road intersection.

   If no turn, mark once, before intersection (about 20 foot) no       
   confirmation arrow. Yes this makes then slow a bit, which is good 
   for intersections.

   If right turn mark twice before turn (pre lane) and one confirmation   
   arrow after the turn.
   If left turn at least 3 arrows per lane and one confirmation arrow 
   after the turn.

Where routes diverge, clearly mark (mileage or maybe Loop “Number”)

Use these same protocols to direct in and out of rest stops and attractions.

If the route moves from street to trail warn the riders on the road at each turn arrow.

Have fun! Don&#039;t inhale the paint fumes!!

Consistency is KING!]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>For the past couple decades I&#8217;ve been the routemiester for GOBA and I&#8217;ve also marked a LAB Rally and been the director of 20+ patch rides for the Dayton Cycling Club.</p>
<p>These (LAB I think) route marking protocols have working very well in moving about 3,000 cyclists a year, an average of 350 mile for the week for the past 20 years with great success on GOBA. These protocols also keep the local city and county governments happy.</p>
<p>Overzealous route marking in our region has created two areas that we now have to ride around, due to unhappy city government. They want their region painted in chalk only, with approval. Not going to happen. I tried and it rained…</p>
<p>We use Fox Valley Systems &#8220;Power Paint Cartridge&#8221; and the &#8220;Spray Chalk&#8221; which fits their &#8220;Easy Marker Pistol&#8221; making the job fairly easy from the driver’s seat of most cars and vans, half the time I do not exit the vechile, just pull to the right and drop an arrow.</p>
<p>I find this paint last longer per can and has a nice consistent spray pattern to work with. If you order it a month or two before the event, it will be fresh and if shaken properly will most never clog. It will store well over a year or two but must be shaken very well!</p>
<p>I find the paint lasts 2 weeks &#8211; 2 years on the road, according to traffic volume. I will not paint the city streets until a day or two before the ride so the markings are bright and fresh. On rural roads I paint 2-3 weeks in advance, re-checking them the day before the event, refreshing the worn arrows where needed, just in case.</p>
<p>The chalk will last through a rainstorm if put down on dry pavement and allowed to dry for a day. The chalk will last a couple/few weeks with no rain on rural roads. On city roads it will last less than a week, sometimes less than a day…</p>
<p>We use the chalk for rest stops, attractions and bike trails where marking is normally not permitted and put it down the night before the event. If rain is forecast, we use signs or paint.</p>
<p>We also use a variety of warning signs for drivers and riders, at hills, bad intersections, gravel (we sweep most gravel in corners), Rail Road tracks with arrows directing best path in red, dogs and attractions.</p>
<p>For maps on the road, I convert the paper and electronic maps I receive into Microsoft Streets &amp; Trips. I take my laptop, plug in a USB GPS receiver, fire up Streets &amp; Trips, tell the program to follow my direction of travel, drive to the start of the ride and follow the route on the computer. Doing this alone cut 10 hours off of painting the GOBA route with less mistakes to fix. And will make a century route with cut-offs, a one day painting job.</p>
<p>Always take a case of black paint to cover up mistakes and old route markings that may confuse your riders.</p>
<p>If the intersection confuses you the painter, take extra time and on the wrong roads about 200 yards up from the intersection, in red paint, tell the riders to turn back, &#8220;NO&#8221; wrong road. This one thing will really pay off.</p>
<p>PROTOCOLS</p>
<p>   Mark every road intersection.</p>
<p>   If no turn, mark once, before intersection (about 20 foot) no<br />
   confirmation arrow. Yes this makes then slow a bit, which is good<br />
   for intersections.</p>
<p>   If right turn mark twice before turn (pre lane) and one confirmation<br />
   arrow after the turn.<br />
   If left turn at least 3 arrows per lane and one confirmation arrow<br />
   after the turn.</p>
<p>Where routes diverge, clearly mark (mileage or maybe Loop “Number”)</p>
<p>Use these same protocols to direct in and out of rest stops and attractions.</p>
<p>If the route moves from street to trail warn the riders on the road at each turn arrow.</p>
<p>Have fun! Don&#8217;t inhale the paint fumes!!</p>
<p>Consistency is KING!</p>
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		<title>Comment on Good bicycle route marking by John Pardee</title>
		<link>http://roadpainter.com/good-bicycle-route-marking/comment-page-1/#comment-12498</link>
		<dc:creator>John Pardee</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 01 Apr 2012 22:02:04 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://roadpainter.com/?p=1#comment-12498</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Here is something I&#039;ve started doing. Just pass every intersection sign, I place my first road mark for that intersection. Using the DOT Vertical signs allows ride to know when to look.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Here is something I&#8217;ve started doing. Just pass every intersection sign, I place my first road mark for that intersection. Using the DOT Vertical signs allows ride to know when to look.</p>
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		<title>Comment on Good bicycle route marking by DamJamJim</title>
		<link>http://roadpainter.com/good-bicycle-route-marking/comment-page-1/#comment-6541</link>
		<dc:creator>DamJamJim</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 06 Jul 2011 13:37:19 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://roadpainter.com/?p=1#comment-6541</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Thanks Dave. Route marking takes way more effort than people realize just because of having to be vigilant about unexpected road construction. There&#039;s also sabotage like we had at Tulsa Tough this year. It&#039;s a good idea to do a last minute sweep to try and fix anything that&#039;s been messed with, but when you&#039;re talking about 3-4 routes from 25 -100 miles, even sweeping is a big volunteer effort.

What are your Route Marking Guidelines and what does your city county government want from you?]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Thanks Dave. Route marking takes way more effort than people realize just because of having to be vigilant about unexpected road construction. There&#8217;s also sabotage like we had at Tulsa Tough this year. It&#8217;s a good idea to do a last minute sweep to try and fix anything that&#8217;s been messed with, but when you&#8217;re talking about 3-4 routes from 25 -100 miles, even sweeping is a big volunteer effort.</p>
<p>What are your Route Marking Guidelines and what does your city county government want from you?</p>
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		<title>Comment on Good bicycle route marking by Dave Christiano</title>
		<link>http://roadpainter.com/good-bicycle-route-marking/comment-page-1/#comment-6459</link>
		<dc:creator>Dave Christiano</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 03 Jul 2011 02:47:09 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://roadpainter.com/?p=1#comment-6459</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Good page! We&#039;re just up I-44 in Springfield. Springbike has formally adopted Route Marking Guidelines in part to be proactive to city/county government. We don&#039;t want riders to get lost but we have to be realistic with the size our markings. Locals don&#039;t like &quot;their&quot; roads painted. I agree completely that small marks will be seen if they are clean and consistent. We also mark every turn after the turn within sight just in case (it happens!) that the county decides to pave over our marks a day or two before the ride.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Good page! We&#8217;re just up I-44 in Springfield. Springbike has formally adopted Route Marking Guidelines in part to be proactive to city/county government. We don&#8217;t want riders to get lost but we have to be realistic with the size our markings. Locals don&#8217;t like &#8220;their&#8221; roads painted. I agree completely that small marks will be seen if they are clean and consistent. We also mark every turn after the turn within sight just in case (it happens!) that the county decides to pave over our marks a day or two before the ride.</p>
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		<title>Comment on Planning New Rides for 2011 at Saint Francis Tulsa Tough! by Buck</title>
		<link>http://roadpainter.com/planning-tulsa-tough-new-rides-for-2011/comment-page-1/#comment-5953</link>
		<dc:creator>Buck</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 14 Jun 2011 13:17:35 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://roadpainter.com/?p=159#comment-5953</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[I live N. of Sand Springs off of Hwy 97 and Shellcreek road. I would love to say thank you for all of the bikes on Hwy 97 Saturday. We had a death in the family, and everyone met at out house, and had a hard time getting there because of all the bikes blocking the road. Everyone who came in commented about being &quot;stuck&quot; behind the bikes because there are no SAFE areas to pass and the bikes refuse to move over.

Also, I would like to thank all of the riders for throwing down your plastic water and sport drink bottles on the side of the road.It is a beautiful sight to see, you really are endearing yourself to our community.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I live N. of Sand Springs off of Hwy 97 and Shellcreek road. I would love to say thank you for all of the bikes on Hwy 97 Saturday. We had a death in the family, and everyone met at out house, and had a hard time getting there because of all the bikes blocking the road. Everyone who came in commented about being &#8220;stuck&#8221; behind the bikes because there are no SAFE areas to pass and the bikes refuse to move over.</p>
<p>Also, I would like to thank all of the riders for throwing down your plastic water and sport drink bottles on the side of the road.It is a beautiful sight to see, you really are endearing yourself to our community.</p>
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		<title>Comment on Good bicycle route marking by Randy Pickard</title>
		<link>http://roadpainter.com/good-bicycle-route-marking/comment-page-1/#comment-5209</link>
		<dc:creator>Randy Pickard</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 07 May 2011 21:15:19 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://roadpainter.com/?p=1#comment-5209</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[I am totally biased, because I sell their product, but I think the marking paint from Fox Valley Systems offers performance that is equal to Rustoleum at a better price. For marking a course 1-3 weeks before and event, I agree that marking paint is the way to go. However, the Fox Valley marking chalk often lasts for weeks if: 1) it is applied to a dry surface; 2) is not rained on by a torrential downpour, and 3) is not exposed to high numbers of tires running over it. Still, it would be risky to use chalk if marking a course a week or more before the event.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I am totally biased, because I sell their product, but I think the marking paint from Fox Valley Systems offers performance that is equal to Rustoleum at a better price. For marking a course 1-3 weeks before and event, I agree that marking paint is the way to go. However, the Fox Valley marking chalk often lasts for weeks if: 1) it is applied to a dry surface; 2) is not rained on by a torrential downpour, and 3) is not exposed to high numbers of tires running over it. Still, it would be risky to use chalk if marking a course a week or more before the event.</p>
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		<title>Comment on Pack Mentality by Buck</title>
		<link>http://roadpainter.com/pack-mentality/comment-page-1/#comment-3668</link>
		<dc:creator>Buck</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 25 Feb 2011 18:34:41 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://roadpainter.com/?p=124#comment-3668</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[My question is, why do you want to ride in an area where you know the locals dont want you there? You are on the narrow 2 lane curvy road, where it is dangerous to try to pass you, at a time when we are trying to get home and pick our families up to go to Church without being late. As I stated in an earlier post 3-4 years ago you guys werent a problem, you would ride to the side , you would leave us room to get around you and you were courteous. But in the last 3 years that has changed DRAMATICALLY. The cyclist are rude to the locals, its as if you dare us to hit you. Just because you have a right to be on that narrow, curvy , unsafe road full of blindspots, doesnt mean that it is the safe or the right thing to do.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>My question is, why do you want to ride in an area where you know the locals dont want you there? You are on the narrow 2 lane curvy road, where it is dangerous to try to pass you, at a time when we are trying to get home and pick our families up to go to Church without being late. As I stated in an earlier post 3-4 years ago you guys werent a problem, you would ride to the side , you would leave us room to get around you and you were courteous. But in the last 3 years that has changed DRAMATICALLY. The cyclist are rude to the locals, its as if you dare us to hit you. Just because you have a right to be on that narrow, curvy , unsafe road full of blindspots, doesnt mean that it is the safe or the right thing to do.</p>
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		<title>Comment on Pack Mentality by Jim</title>
		<link>http://roadpainter.com/pack-mentality/comment-page-1/#comment-3585</link>
		<dc:creator>Jim</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 21 Feb 2011 00:39:49 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://roadpainter.com/?p=124#comment-3585</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Buck, you&#039;ve hit squarely on the point of my article. We bicyclists have been known to preach sharing the road and then turn right around and act like a pack of undisciplined children. That happens sometimes when people of like minds of any activity get together and do their thing. 

If you read further, I say, &quot;Sharing is an equal opportunity action. It means coexisting not dominating.&quot; I also say, &quot;I’m talking about acknowledging that others also have equal rights to the road and exercising some common courtesy.&quot;

The whole point of the article is in the last paragraph where I suggest that we should all work harder to practice the &quot;art of civility.&quot;

But you and I both know that neither of us can change the behavior of others. All we can do is try to find constructive ways to let our opinions be known and continue to function together in community.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Buck, you&#8217;ve hit squarely on the point of my article. We bicyclists have been known to preach sharing the road and then turn right around and act like a pack of undisciplined children. That happens sometimes when people of like minds of any activity get together and do their thing. </p>
<p>If you read further, I say, &#8220;Sharing is an equal opportunity action. It means coexisting not dominating.&#8221; I also say, &#8220;I’m talking about acknowledging that others also have equal rights to the road and exercising some common courtesy.&#8221;</p>
<p>The whole point of the article is in the last paragraph where I suggest that we should all work harder to practice the &#8220;art of civility.&#8221;</p>
<p>But you and I both know that neither of us can change the behavior of others. All we can do is try to find constructive ways to let our opinions be known and continue to function together in community.</p>
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		<title>Comment on Pack Mentality by Buck</title>
		<link>http://roadpainter.com/pack-mentality/comment-page-1/#comment-3584</link>
		<dc:creator>Buck</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 20 Feb 2011 23:11:33 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://roadpainter.com/?p=124#comment-3584</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[what you stated in the article is why we dont want you riding in our area here is your quote 
&quot;On our normal daily rides, it’s pretty easy to get away with loose interpretations of law – rolling through traffic signals, riding more than two abreast, crossing the centerline.

try tightening up your interpretations and just maybe you would have less opposition from the people who live in the area.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>what you stated in the article is why we dont want you riding in our area here is your quote<br />
&#8220;On our normal daily rides, it’s pretty easy to get away with loose interpretations of law – rolling through traffic signals, riding more than two abreast, crossing the centerline.</p>
<p>try tightening up your interpretations and just maybe you would have less opposition from the people who live in the area.</p>
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